Director John Johanas on His Career, the Importance of Hi-Fi Rush’s Song Choices, the Possibility of a Sequel, and More – TouchArcade

Again in January, Tango Gameworks and Bethesda launched certainly one of my favourite video games of all time with Hi-Fi Rush. As somebody who adores character motion and rhythm video games, mixing each collectively appeared like an ideal match for my style, however Hello-Fi Rush did a lot extra. I’ve performed many instances already throughout Steam Deck and Xbox Collection X, and I’ve had the pleasure of chatting with John Johanas of Tango Gameworks about Hello-Fi Rush, his profession, a possible sequel, Korsica content material, utilizing licensed music in video games properly, the video games he loved lately, and much more. With Hello-Fi Rush’s one yr anniversary subsequent month, I knew it was time to speak with John. This interview was performed on a video name for probably the most half. It was then transcribed and edited for brevity within the case of some parts.

TouchArcade (TA): For individuals who don’t know you, inform us a little bit bit about your self, and your position at Tango Gameworks.

John Johanas (JJ): My identify is John Johanas. I’m at present a sport director, inventive director, no matter you need to name it. We simply name it director right here at Tango Gameworks, and I joined the corporate once they began round 13 years in the past. I’ve been there because the very starting, engaged on mainly each undertaking. I had no expertise engaged on video games earlier than this. The primary sport I ever labored on was The Evil Within, then I used to be accountable for the DLCs and the sequel, after which after that, I began engaged on what turned Hi-Fi Rush.

TA: So how did you get into Tango Gameworks then, because you talked about you didn’t have any expertise earlier than?

JJ: Yeah, I actually simply utilized on the web site, and was very open about the truth that I had no expertise, however was simply very desirous about making, this was 13 years in the past, just like the PlayStation 3 period. There was this bizarre type of time in Japanese sport dev stuff the place lots of people had been saying, you already know, these video games are too Japanese for Western audiences. It was this sort of working narrative. And I used to be like that’s not, I don’t suppose that’s the case. And whether it is, perhaps it’s a localization factor, perhaps it’s simply the way in which some options of the sport are carried out that aren’t as person pleasant. In order that was type of like my pitch. Basically once I was speaking about getting concerned, I used to be like I don’t like this notion as a result of I grew up enjoying Japanese video games. I used to be dwelling in Japan on the time, and I used to be like I’d simply love to assist out for no matter we’re making to make it so that’s not the case for what the studio decides to make. That’s simply primarily based on me being a fan of video games and enjoying video games my complete life.

TA: Was there any particular sport you performed at the moment which informed you in your head that it’s good to get into the trade now?

JJ: There wasn’t a particular sport that’s like, wow, now I have to get into the trade. Truly it was a little bit bit circumstantial. I really didn’t even plan on this being like a profession alternative in any respect. I wasn’t pursuing it. I used to be planning to virtually go on to greater training, like graduate faculty, and I simply stumbled upon this website and was like, hey, you already know what, why don’t I simply throw a resume there and see what occurs, you already know?

Worst case, I’ve an incredible story to inform a pair years later that both I utilized to this studio and didn’t get a job, or I utilized to this studio after which acquired fired straight away as a result of I’ve no expertise, nevertheless it’ll be story to inform.

I feel on the time once I was dwelling in Japan, I used to be simply enjoying. I feel I simply acquired a PS3 late into when it was out and I used to be simply going via the catalog of video games, and I used to be clearly very impressed by fashionable gaming at that time. Simply how, how sophisticated and in addition how the constancy and the scope of them was getting so massive. It was very attention-grabbing to me, however I clearly didn’t know the way they had been made. That was a thriller.

TA: Because you talked about you joined from the beginning at Tango Gameworks, how was it working with Shinji Mikami?

JJ: It was nice as a result of he’s an individual who may be very palms on with growth. You generally hear about administrators or undertaking leads, they’re in like an workplace, and it’s very prime down, they usually give orders, and also you simply do issues. He’s very proactive in letting folks become involved in having possession over the issues that they had been doing, even when they made errors. After which he would know to leap in and assist out, or type of allow you to fail, and see your personal errors and issues like that.

You would consider it virtually like a mentorship in a approach. You’re studying a commerce by type of watching and doing. It wasn’t like courses that I used to be taking to study his methodology or one thing like that. It was simply understanding that loads of the sport growth is chaotic. It’s studying whereas doing, it’s attempting, failing. And you bought to see that not from an individual within the workplace, however from somebody who’s actually sitting subsequent to you who’s a director of a undertaking, however nonetheless makes these errors and finds an answer and issues like that.

In a great way it type of took away the form of mystique of this like an invincible director who is aware of all the things. It virtually humanized the expertise.After I work on my initiatives, I be certain that to maintain that custom, or these classes I realized alive by ensuring that there’s possession, and ensuring that you just’re concerned in any respect ranges. It doesn’t really feel prime down and simply form of handing out orders.

TA: You labored on The Evil Inside, then you definately directed the DLCs, and then you definately did The Evil Inside 2 additionally in that very same place. Then got here Hello-Fi Rush. Out of those initiatives, which was probably the most enjoyable to this point, growth smart.

JJ: I might most likely say Hello-Fi Rush barely really exceeds the DLCs from the primary sport for some purpose. The DLCs had been type of enjoyable another way as a result of that they had a brief growth time, however we acquired to strive one thing new, and attempt to do one thing totally different. We failed rather a lot and did loads of stuff shortly, however we additionally type of did what we wished to do. So it was enjoyable to have like, I virtually felt like working, like a Dash, in that sense, and to get see it completed and to get on the market in a short time.

Hifi Rush typically was a really, very enjoyable sport to make due to simply how ridiculous it’s, and the way enjoyable it’s to play. Nevertheless it was a really lengthy course of of creating it, and it was very, very sophisticated to make. So generally there have been loads of smaller particulars that had been a little bit bit overwhelming at instances. However on the finish of the day, after we had been enjoying the sport, it was simply extremely enjoyable simply as builders to play and luxuriate in your sport, which is type of uncommon since you normally get sick of a sport that you just’ve been enjoying for years. However we did get pleasure from it.

TA: I maintain hoping each few months that there will probably be some new DLC or one thing which is able to give me an excuse to replay it. Since launch, there have been some notable updates with sport modes, fixes, and there have been three paid beauty DLC packs. There’s been an Amazon Prime DLC factor as properly.

At this level, I requested John if there have been plans for an replace to have a good time the primary anniversary of the sport. He mentioned the workforce is taking a look at participant suggestions however can’t announce something. I then requested how the workforce felt concerning the unanimously optimistic suggestions to the sport from launch.

JJ: It was a little bit bit bizarre, as a result of we’re used to seeing mixture of, you already know, optimistic suggestions, simply basic destructive suggestions. Individuals simply don’t like the sport, or loads of issues they need improved. Nevertheless it felt so weird to us as a result of our growth was a lot completed at nighttime that nobody knew about this sport. There wasn’t any form of preview cycle. So it was popping out, and we had been questioning concerning the stuff we put in, and whether or not gamers had been going to love it or not. And such as you mentioned, this form of virtually unanimously optimistic response, virtually caught us off guard in a approach as a result of we thought, now we have the stuff that we wished them to say. Everybody appears to be saying. The form of positivity across the sport typically, these are all like bullet factors on our preliminary draft of after we’re pitching the sport. We wished folks to say this and it was our objective for the sport, and folks had been simply saying that. It’s virtually like we’re trying via the feedback for something that might give us assist to determine what we do fallacious? And many of the negativity that we did see was truthfully like “this sport simply isn’t for me, however I can inform it’s very properly made, very properly crafted. It’s simply not for me.” And we’re like, that’s superb.

It’s refreshing from a sport developer perspective to have that positivity, and never be all the time pondering like oh we must always have completed this. So there’s not loads of remorse, and extra simply type of pleasure that comes from that.

TA: After I was enjoying the sport, the one criticisms I noticed was not even that, however simply individuals who don’t like or aren’t good at rhythm video games not having fun with or with the ability to play it. However then I feel the accessibility stuff improved fairly a bit with parry via the updates. So even individuals who don’t like these issues now can simply play it like an motion sport. I’m questioning how that’s out of your perspective if you see this sport designed in a particular approach. Do you suppose the accessibility choices for rhythm gameplay lessens the general affect since some received’t get the total expertise with all of the mechanics?

JJ: I feel with accessibility stuff like that, if the top objective is that somebody simply enjoys the sport as a result of it’s there, I don’t suppose it’s our place to say that that’s an inherently fallacious method to expertise the sport. I feel that we designed a sport round that there’s a approach that we intend you to play it, but when there’s a approach that permits you to play it in a approach that could be simpler, like like once more, perhaps there’s somebody who’s simply not rhythmically inclined and has problem with just like the parrying sections. We thought that we had been type of doing our greatest. We did loads of type of behind the scenes work to form of cowl for individuals who perhaps have problem with it. However trying on the suggestions, we added within the form of auto parry system, so primarily it removes all problem from let’s say just like the Korsica boss battle for instance.

In order that was one thing that internally after we had been first going via it, we’re like, properly, you already know, it is a check we would like you to type of expertise this as a result of in case you can simply glide via it then the following sections you’re going to get caught up on it. However then we realized that if somebody’s, that is legitimately stopping somebody from having fun with the sport, then it’s an choice that you could activate. We have now no problem with that. We did design it with loads of accessibility in thoughts. Although it’s an audio sport, all the things has the visible ingredient in a way. The thought was that even when somebody who’s arduous of listening to was enjoying the sport, they might instantly play as a result of there’s a visible side to all the things as properly. We’re very form of proactive in ensuring that it was accessible to individuals who want accessibility issues, but additionally from only a basic sport perspective you’ll be able to perceive play the sport. It wasn’t too tough, however in case you wished it to be tough, you’ll be able to elevate the problem as excessive as you’ll be able to. So we had been very aware about that.

Lots of people are very form of protecting over issues like that is the supposed approach a sport needs to be performed. However if you’re simply attempting to make a sport that’s about having enjoyable, you don’t need to make something that might forestall folks from having fun with it.

TA: So Hello-Fi Rush runs at 1440p 60fps on Xbox Collection S and 4K 60fps on the Xbox Collection X. I performed it on the latter and on Steam Deck the place it appears to be like and runs wonderful. I wished to know if the workforce thought of a 120fps mode on Xbox consoles.

JJ: I feel there was a short second the place we spoke about it. So the difficulty typically, the explanation why we focused 60fps, I feel folks have that type of false impression when they consider body charge stuff. It’s like if you goal to hit a body charge, it’s not one thing that simply the programmers do. It’s one thing that your entire workforce has to work on. They must work on all of the property within the sport to ensure that they’re made in order that they run at a sure spec. We had been at a degree like early on the place we had been type of determining what we would wish to do to make it run at 120fps, and if we wished it to try this, it must be strong for us. If it isn’t, what occurs is audio desync happens which might have an effect on the gameplay expertise.

We type of noticed what we have to do to perhaps cut back constancy to get it to run at 120fps. It wasn’t only for instance, simply reducing the decision. It will be like turning off numerous shaders, like altering the graph, just like the polygon counts on plenty of issues. A variety of work to try this, and we weren’t certain that it could hit 120fps strong the entire sport as properly. So that will be an unbelievable quantity of labor to hit that. I feel it could be nice to have, however from a restricted dev side we would have liked to form of like draw the road and for us 60fps was a really clear objective that was achievable.

PC customers can’t really go up that prime. So we do this. However after we’re coping with numerous system specs, we wished to make sure that we acquired the expertise that we wished out of that console.

TA: After I performed it, one other factor I seen is that the sport has an excellent rumble on the Xbox controller. I wished to know if the workforce thought of implementing PlayStation DualSense performance within the PC. I assumed a sport like Hello-Fi Rush would dramatically profit from haptic suggestions on that controller on PC.

JJ: I do know we didn’t think about after we had been making it solely as a result of I do know that there are many points typically with ensuring that controller help is engaged on Steam. Mainly with how we’re growing with form of mainly this perhaps Xbox first mindset in that sense, we had been taking a look at ensuring that it labored with that controller set, I really don’t know. This could be a greater reply for the programmers. I don’t know what instrument set is required to make it run okay on PC with the haptics with, however I do know that it particularly didn’t come up.

TA: Okay now let’s discuss Hello-Fi Rush merchandise. When are we getting Korsica merchandise?

JJ: Properly the merchandise stuff isn’t as much as us as builders. We have now an incredible licensing workforce at Bethesda who works on stuff they usually type of take a look at what folks need. So I feel if there’s sure stuff you need to see, ensure you’re telling Bethesda what you suppose is nice. Clearly we’d like to have cool merchandise for all of the characters and we’d like to have all this. However yeah, you’ll be able to inform me. In fact, I’m in your aspect. I would like tons of cool stuff.

TA: After I performed the sport in January, I hoped to see a vinyl soundtrack and a bodily launch. The former happened. Is there any information on the latter?

JJ: I don’t have any information for you. I do suppose the bodily launch is one thing typically that we all know that there’s an enormous demand for. I can clearly see that there’s identical to basic tendencies the place some video games are actually simply getting digital solely releases like that. We’re all the time open to the concept of perhaps or perhaps doing one thing like that if the chance arises.

TA: I additionally wished to know if there have been or are plans for an artbook as a result of the artwork within the sport is wonderful.

JJ: It’s not as simple as simply making an artwork ebook for these items. It’s rather a lot like licensing and issues like that. Clearly the workforce loves the artwork, and you already know they did an incredible job of creating a compilation of all of the fashions, and never all the things, however as a result of now we have an insane quantity of authentic artwork for this sport. Every particular person artist put up on their ArtStation profile on-line, which is nice to see scope of that. Having it in a bodily kind like that I feel could be nice. I do know we did it for the primary Evil Inside. We had an artwork ebook that’s actually cool and I feel the colours, simply the artwork on this sport is unbelievable. So once more, one thing we’d like to discover if the chance rises for this sport as properly.

TA: There has clearly been a ton of fan artwork and loads of actually great things. One in every of my favourite items of fan artwork for the sport is definitely from a buddy of mine, and I feel you replied to them on Twitter about Futurama and its affect.

Alright. It is Saturday night time. I’ve no date. A two liter bottle of Shasta, and my all Rush combine tape. Let’s rock. #HiFiRush pic.twitter.com/JIKjgCykLb

— Virtua Sanus (@SegaUranus) February 5, 2023

JJ: I do bear in mind this. I assumed that is nice for a number of causes. A, simply because it’s like it’s only a good piece of artwork. But in addition as a result of you already know, Futurama itself was like a giant affect on the sport, like the texture and the vibe. Particularly once I was pitching the concept of Chai, folks had been saying like you’ll be able to’t have this character, this essential character who’s not good and isn’t like a hero. I take advantage of Futurama for example of like, take a look at Fry. He’s undoubtedly not the neatest particular person on this group, and perhaps he does some intelligent stuff generally, however he type of like falls into it, and and so I had had lots of people on the workforce watch that present to allow them to get just like the the understanding of this form of like really feel that we’re going ahead.

So to see folks choose up on that, and be like hey this is sort of a Fry-type character, and I used to be like yeah that’s precisely how I introduced as much as the workforce has talked about it. I feel that form of that form of bizarre form of like loser you already know hero factor, perhaps is was a little bit little bit of a cultural factor the place I feel me rising up watching reveals like that, you see the little bit extra and perhaps American tradition, and Japanese tradition particularly with video games they attempt to push for heroes like very very sturdy character with few flaws, however like you already know perhaps darkish previous, you already know is it’s the one factor. However I used to be like no, he’s identical to a goofball. So it’s gonna be enjoyable.

TA: I can’t imagine we’ve spoken for nearly half an hour and I haven’t even introduced up the superlative music in Hello-Fi Rush. How vital was it so that you can get the licensed music that ended up within the remaining sport?

JJ: Whereas I wouldn’t say it was an absolute necessity in attaining the sport’s objectives, there may be simply one thing so satisfying about listening to a licensed observe are available and land completely with a scene. With the idea early on being primarily based on the sport feeling like “a music video being edited round you,” having licensed music, typically, allow us to make that idea extra literal. It additionally lets us mess around with gameplay since as a substitute of the tracks evolving round YOUR playstyle, it lets us set you as much as form of play in opposition to the observe.

As for the track decisions, I simply felt that they’d convey the vibe and gameplay conditions accurately, so I fought arduous on pursuing them and I’m so completely happy we had been ready to make use of the tracks that we did. Some preliminary music decisions had points (and in the way in which we had to make use of the songs, there have been A LOT of ways in which would make the track both not authorized or not ready for use), however I feel each licensed track alternative we used within the sport we made certain it counted so it didn’t simply really feel like background music.

TA: The original score for the sport is Bethesda’s greatest ever throughout its lengthy historical past and franchises. How was it engaged on the soundtrack and lyrics?

JJ: Whereas I completely love our authentic soundtrack, that’s fairly a press release to name it Bethesda’s greatest ever (and a harmful one to say out loud, so watch out laughs). My direct contributions to the soundtrack had been truthfully minimal (simply the vocals on 3 songs), however I labored with the sound workforce to curate the sound kinds for the phases to make sure a inventive consistency with the temper of the sport, the eventual segways into the licensed music, and the way they’d work with the story beats. It was extra like a producer position which remains to be giving me an excessive amount of credit score, in my view. Nonetheless, after giving steerage, listening to the demos after which evolving them into the model within the sport, from Shuichi Kobori, Mastoshi Yanagi, and Reo Uratani for the in-game tracks, was a tremendous expertise. I might hear the demos which might get myself and the workforce excited concerning the part we had been designing after which when it was working in-game, it actually would carry these sections of the sport to life. And on the finish of manufacturing is when the sound workforce would go the additional mile and add in all these neat prospers and transitional components to make every stage simply really feel so wonderful and enjoyable; it was simply stacking these good vibes on one after one other. All of them did such a tremendous job.

Hilariously, the lyrical sections had been actually one of many final issues we did and even the ending track began as a goof of me joking concerning the sport when listening to the completed instrumental within the studio. We laughed, so then determined to take a vocal model of it. It wound up being a bit extra honest than the unique “joke observe” however I feel it bookends the expertise completely.

TA: In case you may make a Hello-Fi Rush 2, would it not be about Korsica and what bands would you want featured?

JJ: Hello-Fi Rush deliberately ends in a approach that’s virtually conclusive but additionally looks like a pilot of a TV present in a “the place can we go from right here?” really feel. So, on this theoretical magical world the place you counsel the sequence continues on…I don’t actually suppose something is about in stone on what may occur, however simply as the unique sport was such a shock, I wouldn’t need to get anybody enthusiastic about what would possibly or would possibly NOT occur, you already know?

TA: What are you at present enjoying, and what are your favourite video games of 2023?

JJ: I performed Spider-Man 2 and that was incredible. I’m at present enjoying via Alan Wake 2, which can be incredible. There are such a lot of incredible video games this yr that it’s prefer it’s arduous to maintain up with them. These had been the 2 current ones. I simply needed to soar in and play, as a result of they hit precisely the kind of factor I used to be on the lookout for.

I’d wish to thank John Johanas, Elizabeth Gabriel, Adam Simon, and James Morton for his or her assist and time throughout this interview.

Hopefully you loved this prolonged interview with John Johanas of Tango Gameworks. Try all of our interviews here.